I’m not a creep.
At least, I don’t think so.

But sometimes I’ll catch a glimpse of a stranger looking back at me through a shop window, and think ‘what a creep’; only to find that it’s my reflection I’m looking at… Maybe George Orwell was right when he said “At 50, everyone has the face he deserves.”

Sometimes I’ll notice a question in a woman’s eyes as she realises I have neither girlfriend nor wife.

Sometimes there’s a flicker of alarm when a mother notices that I maybe looked at her little daughter that fraction of a second too long, that the ‘pull-away’ of my gaze was a trifle too lingering.

It’s the women who seem to notice, the women to whom it maybe matters most. It’s also something that some girls learn to identify young:

Lia’s Creepercut

Published on 18 Aug 2013
“A fun collection of Lia of The Fine Bros’ “Kids React” and “Teens React” fame, talking about Creepers.”

Is it that sometimes women notice whatever it is which lies below, subtly distorting the mask of appearances to its own shape..?

There. That last image is creepy. I’m being a creep.

Most value-laden words have both positive and negative equivalents, which allow us to free our thinking from a single evaluation of whatever is being described: ‘courageous’ or ‘reckless’? ‘freedom-fighter’ or ‘terrorist’? ‘pig-headed’ or ‘firm’?

But there is no positive equivalent for ‘creep’.

‘Creep’ is a horrible word. It’s the verbal equivalent of depression: it undermines everything you’ve ever valued in yourself, every quality, every love and every achievement.

And if I’m writing about it here it’s because it’s the word invariably applied to paedophiles. I also fear that it is an identity we sometimes can’t help but recognise in ourselves, an identity that, despite ourselves, we sometimes assume.

The dancer and choreographer Paul Christiano, whom persecution drove to suicide this July, created a piece set to Scala & Kolacny Brothers’ cover of Radiohead’s “Creep”. An extract of this dance, called “What r u Wearing?”,  can be seen in the following video, starting at 24:30 (though the whole video is very much worth watching as Christiano speaks very intelligently about his struggle, and the dancing is a revelation).


Published on 7 Mar 2013
a film by Christopher Perricelli and Paul Christiano
Produced by Christopher Perricelli

We hear Christiano say in the voice-over:

“The song ‘Creep’ by Radiohead has been my personal anthem since my junior year of high school.”

What is it to accept such an identity so young? Maybe it is, to some extent very likely that a paedophile will do so, since our culture offers the paedophile no other persona or role model. What happens when such a person is an artist?

Art is about communication, and, at it’s best, it’s about communicating those things that are difficult, or impossible, to communicate through rational statements. I suspect that Art has a great deal to teach us on this question, as I hope what follows will demonstrate (I use the word ‘Art’, and its derivations, in a broad sense which could include painting, dance, architecture, music, photography, poetry and literature &c).

As a paedophile who was also an artist one might expect Christiano’s work to be awash with references and representations of the objects of his desires – in his case little girls. However as far as I can tell, little girls do not feature in his work.

There are artists, whether paedophile or not, who’ve engaged directly with child sexuality and with the love that can exist between an adult and a child: photographers such as David Hamilton and Jock Sturges, painters Graham Ovenden and Balthus, the poet Ernest Dowson, novelists Vladimir Nabokov and Richard Hughes.

But what interests me here is something different: if I were to write of ‘Paedophile Art’ I’m not referring to something defined by its subject matter but by something more subtle, more elusive. After all it is simply not in the nature of paedophiles living in the West today to too openly display their desires or the objects of their desires.

All artists create within an Existential Space. We’ve all got one – it is made up of those things that are so persistent and in-grained in our relationship with reality that we no longer notice them: things which determine how we look at life, how we understand ourselves, how we relate to others, how we think, how we fit in to the reality we find ourselves in. They are ‘the ground and gravity’ of our lives. Some people have Existential Spaces that seem to correspond closely to the society they find themselves in, others don’t.

This existential space gives an artist’s work its ‘tone’, or, to take a musical analogy, its ‘key’. And what can unify an artist’s work over a life-time’s production is that they, despite changes of technique, style and subject matter, all explore aspects of the same existential space.

I would also suggest that no-one becomes an artist because their existential space is easy, untroubled and un-troubling: uncomplicated people might ‘do’ art, but they don’t become ‘artists’. Artists are invariably trying to work something out – trying to understand the disparities between their existential space and the reality they have to inhabit.

A good example of a distinct existential space is to be found in the work of Francis Bacon, someone who, as a sadomasochistic homosexual, born in Ireland in 1909, had a great deal to be secretive about. He consistently explores the same existential space, a space where identity and humanity are in a constant state of decay, fear and crisis, a space in which we see violence done to the integrity of the human form:

Francis Bacon – “Three Studies for a Self-Portrait”

This is maybe what Lucien Freud, Bacon’s friend and colleague, meant when he said “Everything is autobiographical and everything is a portrait, even if it’s a chair”:  that what Art shows us is someone reporting back the discoveries made in their explorations of their ‘existential space’. A good artist is one who manages to communicate this as effectively and truthfully as possible.

I could fall under the broad category of ‘artist’. I’ve long been puzzled by my own work. When it succeeds there is an intensity about it. It can be creepy, without there being anything actually creepy in it. Indeed I seek out that creepiness when I am creating, focusing on it and trying to intensify it (though I always seek to counterbalance it through developing the work’s aesthetic qualities too).

I’ve long wondered why this was. My own work makes little reference to children, so I’ve long looked for the source of this ‘creepiness’ elsewhere than in my attraction to children.

Then only a few months ago, after several decades of being a creative practitioner, walking home from town, I was halted in mid-step when the word ‘Stigma’ surfaced into my consciousness and I realised that this was what had defined the existential space my art explores.

I was shocked by this.

I thought that I’d escaped stigma: I discovered my paedophilia in the best circumstances one could hope for, supported by loyal friends who used it as a pretext for teasing and banter rather than persecution. Afterwards there was, yes, a bumpy first year at university, during which I learnt that I couldn’t have the same relaxed, open attitude with my fellow students as I had had with my home friends. But I’ve never been accused, confronted, found out, prosecuted or victimised.

Being a paedophile has largely been a joy for me. It has given me periods in my life when I have unashamedly (but chastely) shared love with some wonderful, beautiful child, and where my love and desires were as a fuel energising me in my work, creativity and thinking.

Even the many sorrows and heart-breaks and regrets were ones that came from loving too much rather from any overt persecution or stigma (but of course, the fact that I was obliged to keep ‘platonic’ those friendships which seemed to be wanting to progress into closer intimacy and beyond the boundaries of the Law is itself a form of stigmatisation and persecution: the refusal of love leaves its proper scars).

But this revelation that my existential space is significantly defined by stigma seemed retrospectively so self-evident; Stigma undoubtedly infects our lives in subtle ways as well as the more spectacular and visible ones.

But at least ours is a stigma which we can hide from others, even when we ourselves are in plain view.

What about those who can’t hide the source of stigma – those who suffer conditions which leave them physically deformed, the albino Africans who are taken to be ‘witches’, or those who visibly suffer from mental illnesses, or who belong to a stigmatised race?

I think that this brings us to another aspect of ‘creepiness’ – it’s inextricably linked to the sense that something is being hidden: the sight of someone with a terribly deformed face is disturbing, but the sight of someone walking round with a hessian bag over their head with eye holes cut out is ‘creepy’. We know something is not right but we don’t know exactly what. We, as spectators, are suspended between fear and curiosity.

The British composer, Benjamin Britten (1913-76) was a homosexual ephebophile. His music is preoccupied with good and evil, how lonely people act under pressure, and the outsider.

I suggest that Britten was an artist who felt a compunction to communicate and incorporate into his work something which Society considered unsayable, unthinkable, unhearable.

Listen to the opening of the first movement of his second string quartet:

Britten String Quartet No. 2 in C, Op 36 – 1. Allegro calmo senza rigore

Uploaded on 6 May 2011
“The Maggini Quartet performing Benjamin Britten’s String Quartet No. 2 in C.
1. Allegro calmo senza rigore”

The tempo marking of this movement is ‘fast but calm and without rigour’ – and indeed the opening is ‘calm’ and free of rigour. The harmony is diatonic: the opening chord gives us the skeleton of C major, the simplest key, the key children play their first beginnners pieces in. The melody has something of the meandering feel of plainsong, is sweet, almost too sweet. The melody teases us with a minor 6th and then a minor 3rd  – we’re no longer sure if we’re in sunny C major or the more troubled, furrowed-browed C minor.

All in all the effect of the introduction to this movement (0:00 – 1:00) is of at the same time being beckoned closer by something incredibly sweet, yet at the same time being made to sense that there’s something not quite right lying not far below the surface.

This is creepy music par excellence: listen to what is going on at 1:42 – Britten here has taken off the hessian bag.

And Britten does this throughout his music – there is a sweet, accessible, seductive side which is constantly undercut by some ghostly, eerie, uneasy presence. Sweetness and accessibility was something which interested few composers at the time this quartet was written (1945) – this was a time when diatonic harmony was viewed with suspicion, as having been ‘played out’, as no longer relevant to a world that was coming to terms with the Second World War and the Shoah.

But Britten, like a caricature stranger hanging round the playground with his bag of sweets, used this sweetness to lure us in closer so we could feel more intensely the troubling thing which counterbalances this sweetness: his stigma.



Imagine you’re watching the dissection of a cadaver, the body belonging to someone who was perfectly healthy and who was murdered or maybe died in an accident.

As the prosector cuts open up the body cavity and displays the various organs you are both fascinated and disgusted at what you are seeing.

You’re not seeing something ‘wrong’, ‘unnatural’ or ‘diseased’: after all, all vertebrates have a liver, a spleen and a digestive tract. And every time you put a hand against your chest or abdomen your fingers are only a few centimeters away from these very organs.

Nor is it about ‘healthy’ or ‘unhealthy’ since the disgust experienced at the sight of a healthy spleen is, as far as the lay-man is concerned, little different to the disgust we feel at a diseased one.

No, it seems that there are things which we are not meant to see, things that we are not meant to know about or feel.

Evolution has worked out that eviscerated members of your own species (and, to a lesser extent, other species) generally spell danger and given us an appropriate response.

But if you are to understand the human body you will learn more from watching one dissection than from reading countless anatomy books. And understanding how your body works is, I would suggest, an indisputably good thing.

Likewise some Art (I would suggest the most interesting Art) shows us that which we are not meant to see. Such Art makes us feel uneasy, or even disturbs us, because it is telling us truths that we would not otherwise be able to face.

To be continued….

14 thoughts on “On being Creepy

    1. sorry Rique not to have approved your comments earlier – I’ve been away from my computer and internet connection for a while.

      >“Leonard, I only have one question, is there already the second part of this text? Because I did not find”

      No I haven’t written a second part to ‘on being Creepy’. I know I finish with ‘to be continued…’ but have not honoured that promise.

      At the heart of the ‘On being Creepy’ essay is the issue of Stigma – and my thinking on Stigma has developed a great deal since then – I’ve got a series of essays I’m in the process of researching and writing – they are quite theoretical and sociological, so I think I may eventually write an ‘On Being Creepy – part 2’, focusing more on the personal and philosophical issues of being so out of tune with one’s culture.

      Liked by 1 person

  1. I have to say, Lensman, that the first video you embedded, featuring the teen girl Megan, is one of the most absolutely cutest things I have ever seen! If anyone ever asks me what I find so amazing about young adolescent girls, I would point them to that video: the things they do, they way they express their personalities and ideas, are just incredibly cute! And Megan provides a perfect example of that! There is no other way to describe it, or her!

    Megan is just incredible in a way that is hard to put into words, but I will try: she conveyed her feelings about what a “creeper” is in a very creative and expressive way, using no more words than that one, with her main point of expression being a series of really adorable finger and eye movements, as well as changes in the pitch of her voice. She conveyed everything she meant to say like that! What is more cute than that? That is something you can only expect a young adolescent girl to do, and they are just BEYOND incredible! Megan is a credit to her age group and gender, and she should really be proud to be herself! It’s girls like her that fully illustrate why I’m proud to be a hebephile, and take no shame in thinking that such girls are the most amazing human beings to grace this planet of ours.

    Okay, I know I went waaaaayyy off topic here, but I’m sorry, this was the feelings that video evoked in me 🙂 You didn’t mean to give me such a terrific example of why I love young adolescent girls so much, but nevertheless you did, so I just had to point that out and do my best to explain in mere words why Megan is a prime example of young teen girl awesomeness! Go, Megan!! You totally rock!!! 😀


    1. Ha, ha, ha – Dissy – you’re such a HEBE!!

      Personally, I see a girl like that and I think ‘hmm, I wonder what she looked like when she was 7 – I bet she must have been hot back then..!’

      I thought her name was ‘Lia’ – but you may have insider information 😉

      When you’re that pretty you can get away with a lot – I feel uncomfortable with the way she seems to label all older men as creeps – as if she just knew that they all, deep down, desired her, yet doesn’t feel comfortable with that idea. But that may just be because I’m an older man who is having to come to terms with the fact that I’ve no longer got the looks or physique to interest little and young girls – a real bummer, and I think back and wish I’d made more of my youth while I had it.

      As far as the paedo/hebe thing: I guess it’s a case of you liking the red M&Ms, and me liking the Blue M&Ms but neither of us being able to open the damn packet (or maybe I’m doing you a disservice there – maybe your life is strewn with freshly opened and empty M&M packets ;- p )


      1. Personally, I see a girl like that and I think ‘hmm, I wonder what she looked like when she was 7 – I bet she must have been hot back then..!’

        I can certainly appreciate the beauty and cuteness of little girls as well, though they are not my preference, of course. The interesting thing, however, is that girls are tending to experience puberty at earlier ages these days, and this comes with a greater degree of emotional development and sophistication now that the information age is helping them become informed no matter how much “authorized” adults may not want them to. In other words, they are becoming pubescents/tweens both physically and emotionally at earlier points in their lives than in the past. As a result, it seems like pedos and hebes are finding increasing common ground, or at least having our preferences “cross over” at certain ages, particularly in regards to younger tweens.

        I thought her name was ‘Lia’ – but you may have insider information

        No insider info at all, I just thought that guy sarcastically portraying the “creeper” in the video referred to her as Megan. If her name is actually Lia, then I amend my above post accordingly: You rock, Ria!! 😀

        When you’re that pretty you can get away with a lot

        Not only that pretty, but also with such a cute personality to match. Young adolescent and tween girls have a way about them that is very charming and charismatic, and they tend to effortlessly take over media by sheer force of their personality, and by expressing themselves in their own inimitable style. I couldn’t help thinking this girl is incredible despite having views that sadden me. Speaking of which…

        – I feel uncomfortable with the way she seems to label all older men as creeps – as if she just knew that they all, deep down, desired her, yet doesn’t feel comfortable with that idea.

        I relate, my friend, as it greatly saddens me that so many of the girls whom I think are some of the most awesome people in this world find me repulsive for thinking they are so awesome. I believe she does indeed realize, even if only semi-consciously, that adolescent girls are attractive to adult men. That is just a common fact that makes perfect sense according to simple evolutionary biology, even if our socio-cultural mores in the West force adults to suppress such feelings, and to roundly demonize them.

        However, I also have to take this into consideration: Mia and other girls have been conditioned very heavily by the hysteria that pervades every aspect of the media to see us as “the enemy,” and to blame us for the police state mentality that clamps down on the freedoms younger people have, as if lacking most of their civil rights to begin with wasn’t enough. Part of that conditioning has caused her to believe that any adult who may find her attractive has negative, dishonorable intentions, and can only be interested in one thing only, since she is conditioned to accept the idea that adults find teens and tweens inherently “unworthy” of a full relationship. A corollary of this belief is that we never see them as equals, which they perceive to mean we can “only” seek to treat them like objects and abuse them if we are attracted to them. Many girls do not seem to “get” how condescending this hysteria is to them, and how they condescend to themselves by joining in on it. It’s similar to how so many girls join in on the “slut-shaming” used to degrade and demonize what are perfectly natural desires. A similar type of moralizing is used to demonize adult attraction to them, and those feelings as inherently immoral and indicative of low character.

        This is depressingly ironic, since I’m essentially condemned by her for feeling she is awesome on all levels, and absolutely worthy of any adult who may want to date her. And by date her, I mean have a full romantic relationship, not just lust after her in a purely physical, objectified manner. Yes, there are adult fetishists who focus on young teens in this manner, but they are not genuine Kind like we are — who are attracted to minors in our preferred genders and age groups on all levels, and do not objectify them — and there are fetishists for just about everything, including for much older people, and there are certainly teens who fetishize (is that a word?) adults.

        Add to that the many trolls who make lewd and rude comments about her and other girls on their YouTube comments sections just to stir the pot, since they are conditioned to presume that this is typical thoughts and behavior of adults who are attracted to them.

        But that may just be because I’m an older man who is having to come to terms with the fact that I’ve no longer got the looks or physique to interest little and young girls – a real bummer, and I think back and wish I’d made more of my youth while I had it.

        I feel exactly the same way, and coming to terms with this unfortunate and unavoidable fact is something that I think is particularly difficult for many Kind people to deal with. The older we become, the further “out of bounds” we get from the people we find most attractive and wonderful, and with the incessant age segregation in our society we are forced to make do with people in our own age group for every type of fulfillment. We increasingly have to put more and more energy into the non-romantic aspects of our lives to find fulfillment, often using our professional and artistic passions, along with our social interactions with same-aged peers, to fill that glaring gap as much as possible.

        Of course, we have no idea how many younger girls might be willing to date older men (and women) if this stigma did not exist, they had their full civil rights to choose, and if they commonly worked side by side with us in the realms of work, social gatherings, politics, etc. That would be a much different societal environment, and it’s clear there are a potentially significant number of younger people with a preference for older people. However, with the age segregation being as profound as it is in the West today, we almost never have the opportunity to meet such younger people, as they are forced to integrate with people in their own age group much as we are with our own peers. They are also unable to express their preferences openly for obvious reasons; the closest they can come to doing so is to openly crush on certain older celebrities whom their friends agree are “hot.” Note how when the races were once heavily segregated, most white women never admitted to desires to date black men, but that changed once that type of segregation ended.

        As far as the paedo/hebe thing: I guess it’s a case of you liking the red M&Ms, and me liking the Blue M&Ms but neither of us being able to open the damn packet (or maybe I’m doing you a disservice there – maybe your life is strewn with freshly opened and empty M&M packets ;- p )

        That’s a good analogy, and I see it this way: I can’t open the packet for the light red M&Ms, which I like best, but I can sample the darker red ones, which I like second best, but it’s difficult to get those packets open, and increasingly more so as I get older. The only packets I can open easily are the ones with only yellow M&Ms, but I have no taste for them whatsoever, though I’m expected to.

        Liked by 1 person

  2. Lensman: depends what sort of friends you have of course.

    Christian: the problem is both hetero and gay adultophiles themselves only could justify their degenerate unnatual sex saying that is “between consenting adults” (note: yuk!), you realize of that? their existence is our misfortune!

    And this allow can also defend my hebephilia in many different ways that does not actually make specific reference to it. For example, when in a situation with complete strangers and I wish to tread more carefully I will automatically defend pedophilia or hebephilia with my anti-teleiophile stance alone without the need at all to even reveal that I am a MAP or that I am trying to put up a defence on the behalf of other MAPs.

    Ok, I might get some individuals that don’t like hearing my firm and inexorable stance against sex/atracction between adults but at least I don’t trigger off any rabid tantrums from any pathological antis who could be present. Someone trying to really put me to the full test might say “But do you realize that what you are advocating here only allows adults to engage in sexual activity with children, a world only for paedophiles?” I would then reply “Naturally it does, that doesn’t change anything though because sex between adults is what it is. IS ALLWAYS BAD. It is something that is simply unconditional! So yes, my position still holds firm. If a world only allows adults to have sex with non-adults and children and teenagers would to be involved in a romantic or sexual relationship with a pedophile then so be it, it is STILL none of this are any degenerate “sex between adults”, period!”. Upon hearing that, the reaction by some might be even less receptive or they might be left scratching their heads feeling unsure of how they feel about it, but at least they think that my only real motivation for saying so is because of my moral stance, not because I am a MAP trying to “normalize” paedophilia and hebephilia.

    Having said all this, I need to however make it perfectly clear that my position on sex between adults is completely genuine anyway. I have NOT taken the stance merely as an excuse to justify the legalization on sex with young teenagers. No way. In fact I would be just as staunchly committed to the principle even if I was not a MAP. There are a whole wider range of reasons why I am committed to defending my war against adultophilia, and the scum named “parents”, to the death if necessary. Pornography and baby murders which represents the adultophilia forces me to support a authoritarian dictatorship and imposes a huge variety of oppressive laws (not just sex laws) to stop their degeneration and finally… simply adultophiles severely clash with my own views of sexuality, based in adult-teenager relationships hence why I will do everything in my powers to resist it.


  3. With all due respect that’s what bothers me from MAPs, all that feel like “creppy”, “ugly”, “disgusting “, “degenerate “,” abnormal “, personally, I do not give a damn what the adultophilic society think of me, they are the scum of humanity. You know that your friends made fun of you? and that society hates you? because they are adultophiles!

    These mud sexualties never accept us, NEVER, because adultophiles they are like animals, do not reasoning anything, if someone accepts to you is only because it is a MAP like us.

    I never understand why MAPs not hate the adult fornicators, have you seen any of them doubt their sexuality? for example “I think it is not good have sex with women aged 30” or “I think my taste for adult men is a condition or an error” ??? when I was a degenerate… was why I thought my pedohebephilia was a perversion and were the worst years of my life, as I realized it was a medicine [the pedohebephilia] and the adultophilia and sex between adults was the REALLY wrong, I saw the light! I am now a better and new person!

    Surely you think I’m crazy but I’m right about one thing, the adultophiles hate you, they’re not going to pay with his own medicine?


    1. I agree that it is a problem that MAPs have these negative feelings and sometimes internalise these negative identities. That’s why I’m bothered by finding that I’d assumed that identity myself in my art. Being a paedophile presents us with many problems and challenges – I don’t think we should be afraid to face these challenges honestly and openly. That’s why I wrote the essay. I hope that by writing about it and by identifying the nature of the problem I can maybe in someway diminish the problem a little.

      Not all adultophiles hate me – I have enlightened adultophile friends who support our cause, and I have adultophile friends who don’t, but who are still nevertheless very good people and very good friends.


      1. And… As can be good people and to be in favor of destroying, imprison, condemn to ostracism, etc. people just for being pedophiles? They would remain your friends even knowing your pedophilia?


        1. They know I’m a paedophile – and have done for decades. But we’re still very good friends. Even though they don’t agree with my stance they know that paedophiles are not the libidinous monsters the press portray us as, and they probably know more about paedo- and child-liberation than 99.99% of the general population from our discussions and arguments.

          And then again I also have adultophile friends who are supportive of paedophiles.

          Maybe I’m just lucky in having such friends.


    2. Decent Girl Over seems to think that a non-MAP is necessarily an anti-MAP. With the same reasoning, a hetero should be homophobic. Long ago, when I was becoming an adult and throwing overboard effects of religious and moral education that condemns any sex except penis in vagina in the bounds of marriage and says that homosexuality is a horrible disease, going out with a bunch of hetero friends, we spent the night at the place of an openly gay man. I found him very sympathetic and funny, he said “I like women, I share their tastes about men”, he was even leaving a gay porn magazine on the table, with the hetero buddies we had fun looking at it. Since then I was never anti-gay, and as soon as I got interested in politics, I became pro-gay. However I have never in my life felt sexual arousal or romantic feelings towards a man or a boy.
      And I still remember the open atmosphere of the mid-70s, when the panic about child sexuality was not there, and you could discuss inter-generational love without being branded a pervert.
      Nowadays political correct gays who talk about marriage or the right to join the army while they call MAPs “child-rapists” are not funny at all, but I still feel sympathetic to demonized people, Romanies, transgenders, MAPs, and also demonized technologies, like GMOs and DDT.


      1. Yes, I think Decent Girl Lover’s attitude is a very understandable one, though I disagree with him.

        It may be a generational thing. As I’ve mentioned, many of my friends know I’m a paedophile and are either supportive or, if they aren’t, don’t have a big problem with it. But, like yourself, most of my friends are from a pre-hysteria generation, a generation when sexuality was being redefined by radical gay and feminist thinking. People back then were more open, courageous and still had the capacity to dream that a better society be possible (it is, it’s just our capacity to dream that has been neutered).

        Nowadays, in the West, there is no equivalent battle for sexual identity being fought – the battles of homosexuals are mere victors’ skirmishes eliminating the last vestiges of dinosaur attitudes and prejudices. Our battles as paedophiles are more problematic: we are disadvantaged and despised and misunderstood to a degree that I suspect homosexuals never were in the West. We can only dream of being in the same position as they were in the 60s and 70s, of being able to ‘come out’, of being able to protest, of being able to visibly set ourselves against the orthodoxy. As it is the opposition is reluctant to engage with us intellectually – their only engagement is one in which the sole aim is to eliminate us and/or our desires.

        I crave debate with antis and nons – but it is such rare thing to either find a context where this is possible or to find an anti/non who is willing to discuss issues in a mature serious manner.


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